There’s nothing “logical” about what you’re saying.
Here is the logic behind both strategies…
The “red” strategy requires a 100% unanimous decision in order for everyone to survive. That means that all 8 billion people on Earth need to all make the same choice.
Versus the “blue” strategy that only requires a simple majority of 51% in order for everyone to survive.
The “logical” solution is to do the math. It is far more likely to achieve a simple majority than it is to achieve perfect unity. By choosing red, you are guaranteeing that at least some people will die, versus choosing blue which guarantees that everyone survives.
The red strategy guarantees the user and everone survives because the only way for a death to occur is for someone to press blue.
The blue strategy attemps to protect other people who press blue because they feel they might even though absolutely no one will die unless people press blue.
Deaths can only occur if the people in the pool press blue. Red guarantees no deaths if people are logical about how the system works. There is no math as death can only occur from choosing blue. Blue does the opposite of guaranteeing everyone survives from choosing red because any blue presses make death a possible outcome. It is the very opposite of guranteeing everyone survives.
So, you disagree with the math? Or you’re just assuming that every person on the planet would choose to sacrifice other people in order to save themselves?
Because either you understand the math, and know that choosing red is going to kill other people…or you don’t understand the math.
The math is irrelevant. Everyone if they choose blue is choosing death. The setup can only kill people who choose blue. Choosing red causes no deaths only choosing blue when not enough people do. It is foolish for anyone to choose blue period. The rules make it impossible for anyone to die if they choose red. Therefore the logical thing to do is for everyone to choose red.
So you admit that your decision is not based on logic.
Everyone if they choose blue is choosing death. The setup can only kill people who choose blue.
But you seem so sure that it’s not only possible that everyone will choose the same button…that it’s even a certainty. So, why pick the red one? If everyone is going to push the same one, what’s the difference which button they all push?
The fact that you think it’s possible for everyone to choose the same button, while simultaneously thinking that choosing the blue button equals certain death, seems pretty bizarre. Your own conclusions contradict your so-called “logic”.
The rules make it impossible for anyone to die if they choose red.
That’s not what the rules say, at all. I’m not convinced you’ve actually heard what the conditions even are.
The fact you think math and logic are the same thing indicates you do not understand logic. It not about what buttons anyone pushes its about how the system works. Its a system where the rules state only people who push blue have the possibility of dying. Therefore people will only die if people press blue. Without blue button pushes. No one dies. This logic problem is really getting me to understand why the world is insane to me. Pushing red is not about greedily defending your life. Its about reading the rules and seeing what is sensible. You can add a moral element by adding just the smallest tweak. There are many ways to do it but musical chairs is likely the easiest where the last button pusher loses a choice and gets blue. But because the rules as laid out. Does not require anyone to be blue or to press blue and further since the only people that can die are ones that push blue. The logical thing is for everyone to press red. I really don’t see how to make this more apparent. People only die if they press blue. Pressing blue is basically saying I want a chance to die.
Ok. Now I know you don’t actually understand how this dil MMA is framed…or you’re just messing with me.
There are only two outcomes to this thought experiment.
the majority of people press blue…and everyone lives.
or
the majority of people press red…everyone else dies.
There is NO scenario where everyone presses the same button. Blue or red. That is not possible.
That means…if the majority of people push red, then someone is going to die. How many people depends on the final outcome. It will be anywhere from 49.9% to less than 1%…but no matter what that final balance is…someone will die.
The only scenario where no one does, is if the majority presses blue. It’s just a simple majority. Any more than 50%, and everyone lives. Blue and red.
You keep insisting that it’s “logical” that everyone votes red…but that isn’t possible. That makes your argument completely irrational, no matter how you try to explain it. You are simply not engaging with reality, based on the rules of the game.
There is a scenario where everyone presses the same button. The one where they read the setup and realize how it works. Which is only people who press blue risk death. No one needs protection. No one need die because they 100% can protect themselves. They don’t need heroes. I did the spaceship shield thing to try and make it more plain and have been wracking my brains for a way to outlay it to make it more clear. Here is my new attempt:
Everyone has a button. One says live. One says die. If you press the live one you will 100% live. If you press the die one you may die. The system that brings death is limited though so if more than 50% of the people choose death the system cannot accomodate everyone and to be fair will not kill anyone. Which button do you push?
You get that just the fact that this is even being debated between you and I right now…let alone all the people who disagree with you online…literally proves your assertion wrong…right?
If you and I disagree on this, right now…how do you conclude that all 8 billion people on Earth are somehow going to unanimously press the red button? By all means, explain how that happens.
And you still don’t seem to understand the basic premise behind this scenario…
You keep insisting that the only way “everyone lives” is to unanimously press the red button. But that’s simply not true.
If 51% press the blue button…everyone lives.
As opposed to needing 100% to press the red button to achieve the same outcome.
“Everyone lives” if a simple majority presses blue…versus your prediction that everyone is going to magically press red, despite all the facts and evidence that says they won’t. You are banking on a break from reality to occur in order to “save everyone”.
Like I said, it doesn’t matter how you try to explain that…it simply isn’t rational.
There’s nothing “logical” about what you’re saying.
Here is the logic behind both strategies…
The “red” strategy requires a 100% unanimous decision in order for everyone to survive. That means that all 8 billion people on Earth need to all make the same choice.
Versus the “blue” strategy that only requires a simple majority of 51% in order for everyone to survive.
The “logical” solution is to do the math. It is far more likely to achieve a simple majority than it is to achieve perfect unity. By choosing red, you are guaranteeing that at least some people will die, versus choosing blue which guarantees that everyone survives.
I disagree.
The red strategy guarantees the user and everone survives because the only way for a death to occur is for someone to press blue.
The blue strategy attemps to protect other people who press blue because they feel they might even though absolutely no one will die unless people press blue.
Deaths can only occur if the people in the pool press blue. Red guarantees no deaths if people are logical about how the system works. There is no math as death can only occur from choosing blue. Blue does the opposite of guaranteeing everyone survives from choosing red because any blue presses make death a possible outcome. It is the very opposite of guranteeing everyone survives.
So, you disagree with the math? Or you’re just assuming that every person on the planet would choose to sacrifice other people in order to save themselves?
Because either you understand the math, and know that choosing red is going to kill other people…or you don’t understand the math.
The math is irrelevant. Everyone if they choose blue is choosing death. The setup can only kill people who choose blue. Choosing red causes no deaths only choosing blue when not enough people do. It is foolish for anyone to choose blue period. The rules make it impossible for anyone to die if they choose red. Therefore the logical thing to do is for everyone to choose red.
So you admit that your decision is not based on logic.
But you seem so sure that it’s not only possible that everyone will choose the same button…that it’s even a certainty. So, why pick the red one? If everyone is going to push the same one, what’s the difference which button they all push?
The fact that you think it’s possible for everyone to choose the same button, while simultaneously thinking that choosing the blue button equals certain death, seems pretty bizarre. Your own conclusions contradict your so-called “logic”.
That’s not what the rules say, at all. I’m not convinced you’ve actually heard what the conditions even are.
The fact you think math and logic are the same thing indicates you do not understand logic. It not about what buttons anyone pushes its about how the system works. Its a system where the rules state only people who push blue have the possibility of dying. Therefore people will only die if people press blue. Without blue button pushes. No one dies. This logic problem is really getting me to understand why the world is insane to me. Pushing red is not about greedily defending your life. Its about reading the rules and seeing what is sensible. You can add a moral element by adding just the smallest tweak. There are many ways to do it but musical chairs is likely the easiest where the last button pusher loses a choice and gets blue. But because the rules as laid out. Does not require anyone to be blue or to press blue and further since the only people that can die are ones that push blue. The logical thing is for everyone to press red. I really don’t see how to make this more apparent. People only die if they press blue. Pressing blue is basically saying I want a chance to die.
Ok. Now I know you don’t actually understand how this dil MMA is framed…or you’re just messing with me.
There are only two outcomes to this thought experiment.
or
There is NO scenario where everyone presses the same button. Blue or red. That is not possible.
That means…if the majority of people push red, then someone is going to die. How many people depends on the final outcome. It will be anywhere from 49.9% to less than 1%…but no matter what that final balance is…someone will die.
The only scenario where no one does, is if the majority presses blue. It’s just a simple majority. Any more than 50%, and everyone lives. Blue and red.
You keep insisting that it’s “logical” that everyone votes red…but that isn’t possible. That makes your argument completely irrational, no matter how you try to explain it. You are simply not engaging with reality, based on the rules of the game.
There is a scenario where everyone presses the same button. The one where they read the setup and realize how it works. Which is only people who press blue risk death. No one needs protection. No one need die because they 100% can protect themselves. They don’t need heroes. I did the spaceship shield thing to try and make it more plain and have been wracking my brains for a way to outlay it to make it more clear. Here is my new attempt:
Everyone has a button. One says live. One says die. If you press the live one you will 100% live. If you press the die one you may die. The system that brings death is limited though so if more than 50% of the people choose death the system cannot accomodate everyone and to be fair will not kill anyone. Which button do you push?
You get that just the fact that this is even being debated between you and I right now…let alone all the people who disagree with you online…literally proves your assertion wrong…right?
If you and I disagree on this, right now…how do you conclude that all 8 billion people on Earth are somehow going to unanimously press the red button? By all means, explain how that happens.
And you still don’t seem to understand the basic premise behind this scenario…
You keep insisting that the only way “everyone lives” is to unanimously press the red button. But that’s simply not true.
If 51% press the blue button…everyone lives.
As opposed to needing 100% to press the red button to achieve the same outcome.
“Everyone lives” if a simple majority presses blue…versus your prediction that everyone is going to magically press red, despite all the facts and evidence that says they won’t. You are banking on a break from reality to occur in order to “save everyone”.
Like I said, it doesn’t matter how you try to explain that…it simply isn’t rational.